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Thread: Throne of the Four Winds Strategy Notepad

  1. #11
    VI Officer - Forum Admin Khrash's Avatar
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    Sep 2005
    Vancouver, WA


    Quote Originally Posted by Kainhighwind View Post
    I'd like to file a motion to rename Team A to Team Jacob, and Team B to Team Edward.

    I read the Twilight Series and have to say... "They are actually pretty good though Breaking Dawn (last book) was by far the best. The first 3 books were very Teen Romance Bullshit. The last book was actually action packed."

    PS: Im Team Jacob simply because Twilight Vampires are fags and the Shapeshifters are bad ass.
    Side Note: The "werewolves" you hear about are not, in fact, "werewolves". Jacob and his tribe are actually Shapeshifters who happen to have taken on the aspect of the wolf. There are, in Twilight, actual Werewolves but Jacobs tribe is not them.

    I recommend reading them even if you have to hide it.

    Im going to read the Sookie Stackhouse series next (True Blood). I hear its excellent and really enlightening if you have seen True Blood s1/s2/s3.

  2. #12


    Quote Originally Posted by Kainhighwind View Post
    I'd like to file a motion to rename Team A to Team Jacob, and Team B to Team Edward.
    That means I am forced into Team A. Vampires always win!

    Edit: Khrash just earned one more cool point.
    Last edited by Ansum; 02-01-2011 at 04:18 PM. Reason: Khrash made me feel good about myself

  3. #13
    Allowed Visitor Bunny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010


    the true blood books are better than the show in some ways, but not as good in others.

    as gruesome as the show is, at times the books are more so. :P

    ive read all the true blood books and the twilight series too, and enjoyed them all. vampires rock!

    What we do for ourselves dies with us.
    What we do for others and the world remains, and is immortal.

  4. #14


    Quote Originally Posted by Bunny View Post
    the true blood books are better than the show in some ways, but not as good in others.

    as gruesome as the show is, at times the books are more so. :P

    ive read all the true blood books and the twilight series too, and enjoyed them all. vampires rock!
    Pretty sure my wife would 100% agree with this.

  5. #15


    Few notes on Heroic: Conclave:

    As we found after our experiences tonight, there are a great deal of possible methods for dealing with the Anshal adds during this fight, and we haven't really scratched the surface of all the stuff we could try.

    Having said that, after our raid, Bauser and I did a bit of research and discussion in Mumble and found some fairly compelling evidence to a method I brought up earlier as a possibility: The Frost Death Knight kiter.

    As it turns out from various video evidences, while we weren't able to confidently prove the AE range of the Spore AE during our own attempts, we now know that the AE range is far enough that a Frost DK can apply his AE snare attack from outside of the range. (Click here for an example of this method in action).

    Back to that in a moment, but we also learned something else which was a question brought up during our raid but we couldn't answer due to the fight chaos: Can the spore AE be "interrupted" by incapacitating the adds during their normal trigger time? This turns out to be true, you can skip the spore AE casts by stunning or otherwise incapacitating them when they'd try to cast it.

    Due to both of these possibilities, we have a number of options in how to deal with these adds.

    Option A -- Full-Kite

    This method is basically to have Kull tank, Boheem heal, and therefore Bauser Frost DPS and kite the adds the entire duration of the fight. This would require Guide and Bauser to be the DPS on Anshal, with Guide there to misdirect newly spawned adds to Bauser. Bauser kites around the edge of the room and uses his AE stun for the period he needs to pick up new adds and thus combine packs together.

    The advantage to this method is that it (perhaps) allows us to keep 3 DPS on the Rohash platform to help with the Shield by never requiring any DPS on the Anshal adds. However, that means the only DPS on Anshal is Guide and the tank (with perhaps occasional drive-by DoTs from Bauser), so I'm a little skeptical that it would be enough DPS.

    Option B -- Interrupt + AE

    This setup would be to use the "interrupt" method for stopping the first spore cast, then quickly AEing the adds down. 5 adds with 208k each means 1.04 million HP total. Once all stunned by Bauser, after the spore cast timer ends, we have ~20 seconds to kill them before the next spore cast. That's 52,000 DPS for 20 seconds, and we'd need to do that every 105 seconds. With just two DPS (likely Bauser and Harkle), I'm not sure whether they plus a healer could do that much AE damage within that timespan.

    If not, this method would require using three DPS for Anshal and two DPS for Rohash, which we know is possible, but Rohash DPS need to find more survival/better burst if that's to happen. Still, 26,000 DPS doesn't seem out of the impossible for a short duration, known timing burst for two strong AErs, so we'll have to try it and see.

    We'll give these a try tomorrow, but I have a feeling one of these methods will "click" and we'll instantly see the light at the end of the tunnel and the rest of the fight will fall into place.

    As for Rohash, the more I look at the logs, the more evidence I see that Kilwenn and Ansum should be able to duo the Storm Shield every time with a bit of planning. Deep freeze is huge (~75-80k), plus the normal bolt that was mid-cast before the Shield cast, and the water elemental bolt should easily be a guaranteed 100k from Kilwenn alone every shield within ~2-3 seconds. Unfortunately my log was out of range of some of Ansum's attacks, but I can't imagine he would be unable to save up burst of 40-50k. Add in Ice Barrier/Shamanistic Rage active just prior to the Shield and it should be perfectly doable every time, in the event we need 3 DPS for Anshal.

  6. #16


    Few more notes for Heroic: Conclave

    Nezir Ultimate

    Undoubtedly there are still many improvements we can make to the rest of the platforms that are contributing to our issues, but nevertheless, we are having a bit of an issue with survival for the Ultimate on the Nezir platform. Now, it's worth noting that part of the reason is because most 10-mans use a Rogue on the Rohash platform during the Ultimate (as they can easily survive it solo with Cloak and Recuperate; eff Rogues). This, of course, means you can reliably utilize 3 healers on the Nezir platform during the Ultimate, which should make it fairly comfortable to survive, even with a spread out raid if necessary.

    Unfortunately, the only non-healer-specced person we have that I can think of that could probably survive the Rohash ultimate solo is Boheem as Balance, since he can still utilize self-heals during the ultimate itself and negate the fall damage afterward of course. However, this would require completely changing the raid setup once again and finding a way to stun Anshal adds that isn't Bauser's AE freeze. The only other method I can think of we have available that would work is to use Kilwenn's Ring of Frost, which of course means we lose his huge burst damage on the Storm Shield, which I don't know if that's reasonable or not. If so, however, I think Kilwenn is probably capable of basically the second highest burst AE damage of the raid behind Harkle, so the two of them should still be able to burn down the Anshal adds as we were before.

    Also, as a side note, I was generally announcing when it was safe to start AEing the adds and thus break the freeze after the Spore timer had passed, but a tip for the few of you that are on that platform: The DBM timer for the Spore cooldown is slightly off (fast) by about 2 seconds, but the BigWigs timer is exactly right. Therefore, my calls for AE were simply ~1 second after the BigWigs spore CD timer expired, and it worked for us every time.

    Therefore, I'd suggest either grabbing BigWigs for that fight if you're a DPS/tank for Anshal, OR I think I can setup a WeakAuras warning for it fairly easily by tracking the time that has passed since Nurture was cast and give us an alert when we can start AEing.

    All in all, this would put Bauser back on tanking and me back on healing, but then allow us to stick a DPS (Boheem) on the Rohash platform during ultimate. If this would work, this would also have the added benefit that the tank on Nezir's platform would have a guaranteed healer sticking around, which would eliminate trouble spots we were seeing with the movement from Rohash to Nezir and back while Nezir is bursting tank damage after the ultimate.

    Anyway, I'm certainly open to other ideas or opinions, but our trouble spots are basically: Consistency for Rohash survival and Nezir ultimate management. Our Anshal method is pretty sound, so while I hate to change the raid setup again, giving us all three healers on Nezir for the ultimate seems the best bet by far to success.

  7. #17
    VI Member
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    Aug 2009
    Brokelahoma :(


    How much damage is dealt during the ultimate by Rohash and how long does it last?

  8. #18


    Quote Originally Posted by Guide View Post
    How much damage is dealt during the ultimate by Rohash and how long does it last?
    The Rohash Ultimate is this: Hurricane (Note that the damage value in the tooltip is wrong at 2500, the actual damage value in the game and in the spell detail is 3500). Therefore, the base damage of the full effect is 52,500 before resists, but also before Slicing Gale stacks. If the Ultimate soaker goes over to Rohash just before the Ultimate and has been gone long enough to lose Slicing Gale stacks, at most they'll get 1 stack before it casts, and thus take 57,750 before resists. For Boheem, as an example, with Barkskin popped in the middle of the ultimate, the pre-resist damage is 48,510 ((3500*12*1.1)*0.8+(3500*3*1.1)), which of course is easily healable by his own Lifebloom stack/Rejuv and maybe a Nourish or two while he waits for the assigned healer to return. He can then remain on Rohash platform until the Storm Shield is broken to assist, and then go back to Nezir to DPS Nezir until it's time for the Ultimate again.

  9. #19


    I agree, the Rohash Ulitmate should be easily survivable for me. Hopefully Kilwenn's ring of frost will do the trick!

  10. #20


    Notes for Heroic: Al'Akir:

    Similar to a few other Heroics so far, the Heroic version of this fight doesn't appear all too different from the normal and I think it's worth putting some time into.

    First, the differences on Heroic.
    • Lightning Strike cones during Phase 1 persist for quite a long time now.
    • Stormling AE lightning also increases nature damage taken by 25% (does not stack).
    • Acid Rain DoT goes up in 1,000 increments every 15 seconds instead of 500 increments (tooltip is wrong).

    Otherwise things look basically identical to Normal. To deal with these differences, we'll need to alter our strategy a bit in a few places.

    Phase 1: Positioning

    I haven't examined our behind-the-boss positions lately, but we need to have everyone spread enough so that Lightning Strike cones will never hit more than one person, but we also need to have a healer in range of everyone. To accomplish this, one possibility is to utilize DPS that can quickly evacuate a position to a safe spot, and try to "force" Al'akir to cast Lightning Strike where we want. That is, because Lightning Strike is cast in a cone aimed at a random raid member, if, in a theoretical scenario, the entire raid was stacked on top of each other, the casts would always face the raid. Given that logic, we can utilize things like Harkle's Teleport or Kilwenn's Blink and stack them with another player who cannot move out immediately and would otherwise be able to soak the damage and be healed.

    Initial Setup

    Everyone has their own position except Vik with Harkle/Kilwenn at the south position, who are stacked on top of Vik. If any individual gets Lightning Strike cast on them, they remain in position so as not to chain it, and are healed through. When Lightning Strike is cast on the south position, Harkle Teleports to his teleport position at the bottom-left healer (usually me) and Kilwenn Blinks out to the bottom-right healer (usually Duux).

    Upon porting/blinking out, this will allow Vikrum to remain stationary and soak the Lightning Strike (since he's already getting focused heals and HoTs that would otherwise be overheal anyway) while the two casters get out safely with only minor chain damage. Once the Lightning Strike disappears from the South position, both casters move back and prepare for the same teleport/blink if another Lightning Strike occurs.

    Yes, before you ask, two Lightning Strike cones can and will be active at the same time, so it's possible a South Cone and a Bottom-Left Healer cone will be active at the same time, thus Harkle can't escape, but in those cases, we pop cooldowns and try to hang on until Harkle can get out (probably continuing to the Far-Left Melee/9 o'clock position).

    All in all, very similar to Normal, Phase 1 seems by far the hard part, so we may even want to get in the habit of Lusting right off the bat to try to minimize chances of gayness.

    Phase 2: Stormlings

    First thing to note is that, unlike normal, because the Acid Rain and Stormling damage will start to climb very high much faster, we cannot keep Stormlings near the raid as we normally do. Therefore, we have two options, and while I'm leaning towards one in particular, it's worth considering both:

    Option A: Bauser or Khrash Pulls Stormlings to the Side

    Identical to our Normal setup, but a melee DPS is off to the side so he can taunt Stormlings out of the raid and DPS them by himself on the side. Their melee is very weak (4-5k) and the AE damage is also pretty low on a single-target, but it keeps that damage off the raid and equally as important, allows the rest of the DPS to focus on Al'Akir. Ideally we'd have Khrash doing this in Ret so we can keep Bauser's damage on the boss, but I suspect at the present, Khrash's Ret DPS is too low to manage them himself, in which case we'll have Bauser manage the Stormlings. The key will be to taunt fresh Stormlings out of the raid ASAP to minimize the AE damage they can deal, and to manage their deaths such that they die at the proper moments to keep the debuff stack going on Al'akir while not clipping it too early. A WeakAuras warning has been created for this by the mod author, so I haven't tested it but it looks like a good way to keep track (requires /focus on Al'akir).

    Option B: Vikrum Tanks Stormlings

    The advantage of this sort of setup is that melee could attack from behind Al'akir for higher DPS (though we could also have melee behind in the first setup by sticking the tank near Bauser/Khrash). The potential issue I see is primarily one of threat: Vikrum needs to keep threat on Al'akir plus all Stormling spawns, even while Stormlings are being DPSed down.

    The other downside is that while we would theoretically get more DPS on Al'akir with this method since all DPS are on Al'akir when not attacking Stormlings, I question whether actual DPS would not be lower doing this, due to target swapping frequently. We could have one ranged person assigned to DPSing the Stormlings and handling them alone, but then we're pretty much doing the same thing as the first method except adding the complication of the tank needing to agro them.

    Therefore, I think Option A is the better choice, but we can certainly try things out and see.

    Phase 3: Movement Pattern

    While we've messed around with this sort of thing, we never put it into major practice, and that will need to change to last as long as necessary for Heroic Phase 3. Since Lightning Clouds last 30 seconds and are cast every 10 seconds, we don't need to do anything really complex, and instead the pattern should be as follows:
    • At the start of Phase 3, move all the way to the top and also behind Al'akir, so we maximize melee DPS.
    • Cloud #1: Move down slightly, just below Cloud #1.
    • Cloud #2: Move down slightly, just below Cloud #2.
    • Cloud #3: Move all the way down, just above the bottom cloud (the bottom edge of Al'akir's cape looks like a good place to plan for).
    • Cloud #4: Move up slightly, just above Cloud #4.
    • Cloud #5: Move up slightly, just above Cloud #5.
    • Cloud #6: All the way up, pattern repeats.

    Similar to Normal -- with a proper pattern, quickly killing any remaining Stormling, everyone keeping close to Al'akir so Wind Burst doesn't knock you out of the combat area, and moving away from the raid if you get Lightning Rod -- this last phase looks like the easiest by far.


    I suggest checking out any of the videos listed in this search result:

    Ignore the advertised ones and the first result from tgnWorldofWarcraft, which is a douchebag channel where the guy makes videos from beta, calls them How To, and proceeds to actually kill nothing nor give any pertinent advice. But Vigil, ScrubBusters, Mekanik, Raiding Rainbows, etc. are all good 10-man examples.

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